XMPP is such a pain in the tukhas. Is this REALLY the best we can do?

I know I’m a tech nerd because instead of having nightmares walking somewhere naked, I have dreams where XMPP OMEMO doesn’t work and I *dont notice* until it is too late. Dash it.

The problem with an eternally extensible protocol is that unless basic expectations are met across the board, it becomes a disgusting muddle for users. If Alice’s client has different extensions than Bob’s, and Charlie’s server doesn’t support them, then everyon becomes a goofus schmuck. Funtimes.

@Shufei What is a protocol for you ? I am voluntarily asking you this question.

@Shufei If you don't like XMPP you might be interested in nextcloud talk, chat over imap, or matrix.

Though poking around in the sqlite databases inside of zoom leads me to think they're using xmpp for at least part of it.

@alienghic The protocol itself is a monument to nerddom so far as I’ve read. But nothing seems to work across the clients and servers, not how they proclaim. I wrestle with it far too much. Thanks for the pointers. Nextcloud talk might be a good go for some use cases. Maybe matrix. Looking around for a reliable and mobile friendly setup.

@Shufei Conversations + prosody with a few extra modules works pretty well for me.

Nextcloud talk has better video calls than xmpp but doesn't do federation, though it does have anonymous random link access to the web client.

@alienghic I do wish Conversations was on other OS. Siskin is coming along. Trying out some new Linux soon.

@Shufei Sisken does look promising. I wonder if there's any decent Windows client.

I just found references to Psi and Gajim.

@alienghic Gajim is alright, once one figures out some UI eccentricity. None of this is really ready for non-geeks, though.

@onan Rev, I’m about to fling cuneiform at the internet sometimes, haha. I really am.

@Shufei i can't figure out which among OTR (current, previous) OMEMO (v!?) and PGP (o? gnuo? wtf!) we're supposed to assume for and over which freaking protocol we're supposed to verify!

@nydel I’ve yet to see a client which makes it clear how one is supposed to deal with encryption, hoe the keys are exchanged and why some don’t. Never mind XEP and why some servers won’t play nice with things. It’s a mess of a tech ecosystem.

I always thought it was that XMPP gives us a lowest common denominator, similar to email. Like you can at least expect everything to say hi to each other. Kind of a bummer that it isn't that cut and dried.

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